Sid: My guest Mark Virkler, I’m so excited to be releasing to you his three CD set and workbook on “How to Hear God through Your Dreams.” Trust me; this is different than any course you’ve ever heard about before. The biggest difference, it works. Mark, earlier in the week, you told me something that excited me immensely. You said that it’s Biblically possible and it’s experientially possible for us to receive gifts in dreams; explain what you mean.
Mark: Alright, Solomon received a gift in his dream, he had just been put in as King and he was scared, he was young and he was afraid and if you go to 1st Kings Chapter 3 verses, well it’s just the first ten verses or so. It says that “In Gibeon the Lord appeared to Solomon in a dream by night and the Lord said, “Ask what I shall give to thee.” And then what he asked back for was, “Give therefore thy servant and understanding heart and in the Hebrew it’s a hearing heart and in the New American Standard it says, “Hearing heart, so I can judge thy people that I may discern between good and bad for who is able to judge such a great people?” And God says back to him, “I have done according to your words, I have given you a wise and understanding or a hearing heart so that theirs none like thee before thee nor shall any arise after thee.” And it goes on to say, “In addition I am going to give you a couple other things too. All right I’m going to give you riches and honor, things that you did not ask for in additions to a hearing heart.” And then in verse fifteen it says Solomon awoke and behold it was a dream. And he went to Jerusalem; stood before the Ark of the Covenant and offered burnt offerings and he worshipped. And he said, “God just encountered me, I just received something from God and I’m going to worship Him for what He gave to me in this dream.”
Sid: Now, do you know any people that have received gifts from dreams?
Mark: Well, you know the gift that God gave to Solomon was a hearing heart. The ability to hear the Holy Spirit in his heart, give him wisdom so he can make wise decisions and of course you can make wise decisions you have favor amongst men and you also have the blessing of God in prosperity. And I think anyone and everyone who begins to hear God through their dream including you know, including you Sid. You know you shared your dream with me a couple days ago, you know that things before you. And you can make a dream with counseling you to approach people in a wise manner and by you saying yes to that and approaching them in a wise manner you have favor with that people; and so I really believe this kind of thing happens all the time to all of us. We receive hearing heart, we receive revelation and the result of that is blessing and prosperity in our lives.
Sid: So in affect your also saying to me that dreams can release creativity.
Mark: Absolutely, absolutely and so much creativity comes from dreams. The scientist that was looking through a telescope trying to figure what a Benzene molecule looked like, he couldn’t figure it out. So he had a dream that night of a dog in a circle chasing one another, he had the tail of a dog in front of them in their mouth and he woke up in the morning saying I wonder if the Benzene molecule is circular? And he was able to prove and through his microscope that it was. The guy who developed the sewing machine couldn’t figure out where the, how to thread the hook of the sewing machine; and in a dream that night God gave him a picture of how the thread should go into the needle of the sewing machine. So I just think probably almost all creativity comes through this kind of a means.
Sid: Mark, give me a life situation of someone that had clues to their own health as the result of a dream.
Mark: A lady who worked with me as my personal assistant and she had a dream at night that she entered into her house and she could smell smoke and she went looking for the fire. And finally found the fire down in the kitchen in the lower cupboard and she didn’t really respond to that dream because you really didn’t know exactly what that dream meant but, a couple of months later she went to the doctor and the doctor said, “You’ve got a fire inside of you, you’ve got an inflammation in your intestines caused by stress and I’m going to give you some medication and you need to relax. And so she took the medication, she relaxed and it went away but that dream was telling her that two months earlier that in your home the place that you live, your body there is a fire, it’s in the kitchen area which is where we eat food which symbolizes the digestive track, it’s not in the upper cupboard, which would be my esophagus it’s in the lower cupboard with is my is my intestines; and in my intestines there is a fire. So she was warned two months before pain warned her of a sickness and she could have averted it by relaxing. And a year later when the dream came back she knew that she was being warned a second time, okay. Your under stress again, if you don’t relax your going back to the doctor and she relaxed immediately and did not need to go back to the doctor, did not need medication so in that case she heard the counsel of her dream, acted on it and averted a sickness as a result of it.
Sid: Mark, in the times we’re living in can you imagine if God gave someone an idea for a business, or how to make money that they could end up being part of that great wealth transfer. Give me a real life example of someone that had a dream that released creativity.
Mark: Alright I’ll tell you about a young man named Eric Rose; when he was in college he was training to be an artist, but he quit because a performance orientation just wrecked it for him so he left that and he went into a totally left brain kind of a job. I believe it was an accountant, I kind of forget right now, but when he became a live to dreams God gave him several dreams reigniting his passion to draw and to paint and to create the vision that God was giving to him. And God took him a step beyond what he’d done in the past. Because God called him into sculpturing and making six foot sculpture out of bronze you know; of beautiful, beautiful action kind of figure, people worshipping in the presence of God; totally alive and you could just… And he showed me some of these pictures and they were just totally alive and this thing sold for just thousands of dollars. And so God restored a crushed part within him, brought him back and enlarged the gift that God had initially given to him and made it into something where he could actually produce an income while he blessed the world and the Body of Christ.
Sid: Well, you know you’ve actually been corrected in your attitude towards people through dreams; tell me about the time God showed you people are far more important than projects.
Mark: Well, we were in India and we were going to tape for two weeks straight, six days a week ten hours a day; we were going to tape six of our key courses. We taped a hundred sessions, I never talked ten hours a day for six days a week, I wasn’t sure I could do that. And I was pretty nervous because we were going to be on TV and I had a dream that first couple days that I was there. I had a couple two or three dreams, the first dream somebody came and asked for me to pray for them in the dream and I just pushed them off, brushed them off I was too busy, you know and I felt terrible, I thought Mark, how could you do that? And the second dream I had my computer got stolen from me and then it got destroyed. And when I got up and journaled about those dreams and asked the Lord, he said, “Mark, the people that are working the camera’s here are more important than what you’re producing and I want you to teach them how to…
Sid: By the way, in the natural that doesn’t make sense, what you’re producing should be more important than the people doing the cameras, but from God’s, from a spiritual perspective that’s not true; from a natural perspective that’s true.
Mark: That’s exactly right and God the Wonderful Counselor is rebalancing me and saying, Mark, put people first. And so I asked him, the guy that was running the production, “Could we have morning devotions and I’ll teach these guys how to hear God’s voice and how to interpret dreams? And the team said, “Sure,” and so in the morning we journaled and learned how to hear God’s voice. We shared journaling and over lunch time we shared dreams for two weeks straight and those guys became proficient in hearing God’s voice and interpreting dreams and we tapped over a hundred sessions over that two week period.
Sid: But had you not listened to God you would have tapped, but I believe the anointing wouldn’t have even been there like it was.
Mark: Well, that’s exactly right and the friendships that developed there amongst us still remain to this day. You know we brought life to everyone that we were touching there, not just those that watch us on DVD but everyone received the life of the Lord Jesus Christ.
Sid: I’m going to talk about a man that was in ministry for his first fifteen years that thought all dreams were pizza and then you got the revelation through a man that lived ninety-three years that studied dreams and now today; you look forward to your dreams. How would your life be different if you had never gotten this understanding?
Mark: Well, I would have missed so much wonderful counsel from God and I would be out doing things in an imbalanced way and much more calm.
Sid: You’d be doing things in the flesh rather than doing things by the Spirit.
Mark: Yeah, but I’m a must more caustic individual and I wouldn’t be softened by the power of the Holy Spirit to change me and say “Keep people first, love people, don’t get consumed with projects. So, so much of my personality and life has changed as a result of that and success I believe also.
Sid: I want you to speak to someone that’s listening right now and has just said, “That’s him, he has a gift, he can understand dreams; I’ll never be able to.”
Mark: Ha-ha. Alright I’ll just simply say that that is a lie from the enemy that is not true because I did not start out with a gift on interpreting dreams; I’m a left brain thinker, theologian, Baptist background and dreams and visions and intuition was impossible for me. And God taught me how to do it and I can lay it out lineally with a clear lineal set of rules that you can follow so that you can reproduce in your life what God has produced in my life. I promise and guarantee that can happen.
Sid: Okay, now I want you to give, even though they don’t totally understand yet, because they haven’t gotten your course; I want them to start dreaming. Give them instructions on what they should do tonight very quickly.
Mark: Alright just as you go to sleep just say, “God, give me a dream, I believe in dreams, I’m asking you to speak to me.” Put your bed, and say, “Heart, when you wake me up, I will record what you give me. And then get yourself eight hours of sleep if at all possible you want to aim for eight hours because it’s going to give you the best opportunity for dream time and when you awaken if a dream is there begin to jot it down the summary of it and if you don’t remember all of it, don’t yank on it, just gently tug and say, Holy Spirit remind me the rest, attune the flow and let it just bubble on up to you.
Sid: My guest Rabbi Jonathan Bernis. We found out that he came from a nice Jewish background, mother Jewish, father Jewish and he had a Young Life coach that invited him to meetings, but because he’s Jewish he says it’s not for me, that’s the only door I will not knock on. I’ll knock on drugs, I’ll knock on sex, I’ll knock on money, I’ll knock on New Age, I’ll knock on every door but I will not knock on the door that says Jesus because we Jews are instructed to not to do this. So he had a druggy friend, Suzie that had had an experience with Jesus and there was such a transformation in Suzie that Jonathan was taken back. But then Suzie got pushy and kept inviting him and inviting him to Bible studies and to finally to get her off his back or for whatever reason, he went to a Bible study and to get out of the place he says a prayer, he doesn’t even mean it. But he did have something supernatural that happened to him, his clothes were wet because he was I guess on a motorcycle…
Jonathan: Yeah, you remember real well.
Sid: They had to dry your clothes and so while they were drying it you sit in a chair and what happened?
Jonathan: Well, I was a captive audience my clothes are still in the dryer and now…
Sid: You want to get out of there bad!
Jonathan: I want to get out of there, I felt totally out of place Sid, I didn’t belong there; it’s a horrible experience and now I’m being invited to come upstairs with the leader of the Bible study. Who was not only a Christian but a German Christian with a strong German accent and I was you know the holocaust, stay away from the Germans and Christian’s blame us for killing Jesus, but I went upstairs and I sat on the sofa and he put a Bible in my hands. And this brings up a misconception that many listening have, many Christians that we Jews know the scriptures better than they do. Well, that’s not true Sid, we were the people of the book, but we’ve never read the book and I didn’t know what my own scripture said. So he put a Bible in my lap and I felt like it was a trick house, the room began to get hot, the couch felt like it had arms that were reaching out and grabbing me. And it really was a supernatural experience looking back, I felt very uncomfortable and I felt very separated from God. That’s all I can say, I didn’t hear any voice, I didn’t see any vision but I felt the presence of something in the room that really got my attention. And he kept pushing me, pray with me to receive Jesus, pray with me to receive Jesus. And Sid, I’m sweating, I’m uncomfortable, I want to get out and finally I just said, “Okay, and I prayed this prayer with him inviting Jesus into my life.” I didn’t mean it, after I prayed the room seemed to come back to normal temperature, the couch released me, this Bible that felt so heavy suddenly shrinked to a normal size and my clothes are finally dry and I raced out of there.
Sid: Talk about a captive audience, you had to have your clothes because they had to be dried, you were soaking wet!
Jonathan: Yeah, it was crazy, crazy experience ha-ha.
Sid: And so then the next morning you have a compulsion to read the Bible in particular the New Testament. And this Young Life Coach from many years ago gave you one; it’s sitting in the trunk. You go from the University to your home a hundred miles, you get the Bible, you don’t even talk to your folks, you don’t even know if they’re there. You go home and you just consume yourself reading the Bible and he comes to such a shock. It’s the most Jewish book he’s ever read. Now but you said the prayer, you’re reading the Bible, it’s all against everything that you’ve been taught as a Jew.
Jonathan: Exactly.
Sid: But you like it, what happens next?
Jonathan: Well, Sid I want to recap how bazaar this new desire to read the Bible came from, where did it come from? I’m at this time studying business administration, I’m doing drugs still, I’m very content with my life, I’m enjoying myself party, party, party. And suddenly after praying this prayer and deciding I want nothing to do with this this is bazaar, it’s not for me I’m Jewish I have this overwhelming desire to read, not just the Bible but the New Testament. So driving a hundred miles each way just to find this Bible was in itself, looking back a miraculous thing. And then as I began to read the Bible I began with the book of Matthew, Sid. The discovery of how Jewish this book was! Jesus was a Jew, all the disciples were Jewish, he was sent but to the lost sheep of the House of Israel, the 3,000 saved at Pentecost all Jews. Sid, it was absolutely, I can’t explain it other than to say that it was life transforming. It was as if the words were jumping off the page at me and it was sinking right into my heart. The reality of these people, these Jews that were experiencing the transformation of life and they hadn’t converted to another religion they understood that this was the promised Messiah and He completely changed their lives. And then Sid what was even more amazing was going back to my own scriptures, the Jewish scriptures, the Torah, the prophets, the Old Testament and reading it for myself, really for the first time.
Sid: And very few Christians have ever done this. What feedback do you get from Christians that are reading your book “A Rabbi looks at Jesus of Nazareth?”
Jonathan: Well, they’re falling in love with Jesus all over again because their seeing things about Jesus that they never saw before. That he’s Yeshua, the salvation of God and their saying that they are being born again again; that they’re falling in love with Jesus all over again. But the second thing that I’m finding out from people is that as they read the prophecies the Messianic prophecies written hundreds of years before Jesus was ever born and I go into them in detail and describe what is actually being prophesied, I find that Christians have never seen these things before and its’ restrengthening their faith. It’s just like a shot in the arm Sid and this is what happened to me. I’m reading the Old Testament for the first time, I’ve prayed this prayer, I don’t still believe it in my mind, but I begin to read Isaiah 53 that talks about not only, “By His stripes we are healed, but that He would be rejected by our people. Psalm 22, a picture of the crucifixion.
Sid: And any Christian that understands this revelation, number one will be able to share with a Jewish person that we can have the full dwelling place of God in the Spirit and Jesus can return. But number two, will finally get the understanding of the New Covenant that you plain cannot get from a Greco Roman. As a matter of fact how did something that started Jewish that you had to be Jewish to even be part of and we’re talking about the first followers of the Messiah, come to the part to we Jews say we can do anything but believe in that Jew, Jesus? And they don’t even know that He’s Jewish?
Jonathan: It is a demonic blindness Sid. It’s a blindness covering up the eyes of the people.
Sid: If it’s demonic, how did it happen though? How did something so Jewish become the opposite of Judaism.
Jonathan: There’s an adversary of God called the devil that has not only blinded the eyes of the Jewish people from recognizing Jesus, but in a very real way has blinded the eyes of Christianity, traditionally from embracing the Jewish roots of the faith. And so that had led down this road that has created two distinctly different religions, Judaism and Christianity never the two shall meet. And in reality, the Bible teaching something completely different, and that’s why this is so eye opening to Jew and Christian that read this book.
Sid: Well, what I understand is that it was for distancing the Gentle Believers from Judaism that they threw out the God Feasts, the Biblical feasts.
Jonathan: That’s right.
Sid: And substituted local feasts with good Christian meanings, why did they want to distant themselves from the Jews, the church leaders?
Jonathan: Sid, there’s a number of different reasons that I go into in the book. And in the beginning of the second century and by the mid second century this was a pervasive theology but as early as Justin Martyr for example who we think of as a great martyr taught that “He who is a Jew and a Christian is neither a Jew nor a Christian.” This was part of the demonic plot, I believe at the root of it to divide Judaism from Christianity and disguise a faith that was to be the fulfillment of the writings of the prophets in the Torah into something that was completely different. I talk about Joseph in relationship to this Joseph the Jewish brother rejected by his own brothers, goes off to Egypt where he is in prison, but then comes into prominence and then when his brothers see him again, they don’t recognize him? Why Sid, because he’s wearing Egyptian clothes. Because he’s wearing Egyptian makeup and Jewelry, Egyptian hair fashion and they don’t recognize him at all. Not only because of the spiritual blindness but because he looks completely different. And that’s the way Christianity looks to Jewish people today.
Sid: Jonathan I happen to believe that God raised up Messianic Judaism to have a course correction for the Gentle Church. When would you say Messianic Judaism started, modern day?
Jonathan: Well, yeah modern day, I think it began in the first century with the first followers of Jesus. But in 1967 Sid Bible history was completely shifted and this is according to a prophecy made by Jesus himself in Luke 21:24. Jerusalem will be trodden down by the Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles come in, or be fulfilled. This is what we saw in 1967 after the six day war, the city of Jerusalem came back under the control of the Jewish people after almost 2,000 years and almost immediately Sid, there was an outpouring of the Holy Spirit in the Church called the Jesus Movement or the Charismatic Renewal and it was differently connected to this shift in the age, Biblical age when the times of the Gentiles had come in and with that came Jewish people into the Kingdom of God in greater numbers since the first century.
Sid: Isn’t it interesting that there is a definite tie in to great events in the history of the church and great events in the history of Israel. Most Christians aren’t even aware of that.
Jonathan: If you look at the history of the Jewish people, even the modern return to Israel, Zionism with Theodore Herzl all the way up to the Jews returning if 1948 or Israel becoming a nation, 1967 you see a parallel event in the church because the destiny of Israel Sid and the destiny of the Church are inseparably connected. And that’s why it’s so important to read materials like my book…
Sid: And most Christians they don’t even have a clue.
Jonathan: Not a clue.
Sid: …and the depth and the richness that is missing as a result of them being robbed of their heritage.
Jonathan: And robbed is the right word Sid, because when it’s restored it brings absolute transformation in life. Paul said it this way, when they come back it will bring life from the dead. That’s what happens when Christians begin to rediscover this; it brings life from the dead.
Sid: Oh, I believe in literal, I believe that when Jew and Gentile come together to become that one new man it will birth the life from the dead, resurrection power and we’ll walk in the same miracles Jesus did and even greater.
Sid: We want everyone everywhere to experience true joy and the only way that you can experience true joy is to be in the Messiah; having Him Lord over every area of your life. There is nothing to compare to that. My guest John Waller knows what I’m talking about, some of you are familiar with him many of you familiar with John Waller. If you saw the movie “Fire Proof” which was the number one independent movie in 2008 the theme song of “Fire Proof” which was “While I’m waiting” that was John Waller. And it’s very very interesting how he wrote that had nothing to do with the movie. But I just listened to his brand new CD called “As for Me and My House” and I can’t listen to it enough! John Waller you’re getting not just this One, but your other CDs which will make available. You’re literally, I told you before we even got on the air that I believe that when people hear the first cut of this brand new CD “As for Me and My House” that they’re going to be healed and delivered and set free in an amazing fashion. What has the Spirit of God told you because it’s new about this?
John: Well, that’s exactly what I’ve been told for quite some time now, you know just prophetic words about this music going out and healing people. It’s the Word of God; I pretty much plagiarized the Word of God. I take the Word of God and I put it to music because I know that there is power in the Word of God and when it goes out it doesn’t return void. But I believe that there is a prophetic voice that is in some of these songs particularly “Our God Reigns Here!” That is an incredible declaration and also it empowers the Body of Christ to use the authority that they have been given in the Messiah, in Yeshua to be able to come against any spirit of the enemy that is tormenting them. And I can, we’ll get to it later, but I for years suffered from depression; so I know what tormenting spirits are like. And so I’m just thankful for the opportunity that is going to go out through your program.
Sid: Well, you know what? Before we even get into the interview I want to hear that, I personally want to hear that again. As a matter of fact John, I was thinking of just doing some sort of a CD loop and just playing that whenever I’m not in my home so when I get into my home, the atmosphere will be cleanest it possible could be.
John: That is an atmosphere changer, that song.
Sid: I want you to hear this and see whether you agree with us or not.
Excerpt of “Our God Reigns by John Waller:
Sid: Now that was “Our God Reigns by John Waller and you’re familiar with him if you saw the movie “Fire Proof” because he wrote the theme music of that which is called “While I’m Waiting” and if you like that music you’ll like all of his music. As a matter of fact John Waller when you were in college you told me you memorized a lot of scripture. Why did you do it then?
John: Well, I had a roommate, I was a freshman and my roommate was a senior and had been walking with the Lord for quite a few years and he taught me how to systematically memorize scripture and how to hide the Word of God in my heart and how important that was. And so he just told me that I should do it; so I was like okay, I’ll do it and I began to memorize so many verses and by the end of my Freshman year I had memorized over one hundred and fifty verses. And I started writing songs that year, my freshman year in college so the Word of God would just naturally come out; it’s what you put in comes out.
Sid: When you were seventeen you had an encounter with the Lord and you understood true repentance, I think that’s a word that is not really mentioned that much anymore.
John: It’s not, in fact I was raised in a Southern Baptist Church and my understanding of the gospel and salvation was simply more of fire insurance kind of approach it was just a you know just confess that Jesus is Lord now and be baptized and that’s pretty much it. And yet you know, lives aren’t changed I mean what is the problem? The problem is that there’s no repentance and Jesus taught repentance. I mean you take up your cross and you die to yourself and you follow Him you know and I had never done that. I prayed the simple prayer and I had been baptized and yet all my life had never reflected any fruit and yet Jesus said, “A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, a bad tree cannot bear good fruit;” and yet my life had no fruit and I understood that for the first time as a seventeen year old young man and I decided you know what Lord, I never really followed You, so I don’t know You. And so I gave my life to Him at seventeen and I’ve never looked back.
Sid: Can you image what your life would have been like with all that you went through and will find out on tomorrow’s broadcast if you hadn’t had the word hidden in your heart?
John: I don’t even want to think about where I would be.
Sid: I understand.
Sid: I am so excited about the supernatural revelation that my guest Joel Richardson has had in understanding the end times. Joel, Daniel talks about understanding the end times and how he talks about the scroll which would be the scriptures will not be understood until the time of the end. Comment on that.
Joel: Thank you Sid, this is an incredibly important scripture that many interpreters over the past fifty years and even down through church history have ignored because it specifically says that at the time of the end and it even says, that “Those of your brothers that sleep in the dust of the ground will awaken.” This is talking about the end times, the time when the resurrection of the dead takes place. It says “In the last days this book would be unsealed and understood,” and as much as possible I tried to adhere to a historical Christian Orthodoxy. I try not to, you know to make up my own doctrines, I want to adhere to those things that have been believed by the church down through history, but if there has ever been a verse which is essentially invites a contrarian interpretation, this verse says that down through history the church was believed that the book of Daniel was largely pointing us to the Roman Empire. And we’ve heard this so much coming out of a lot or prophecy circles since the days of the Jesus Movement and Hal Lindsey and “Left Behind” and so forth. And much of the world today is looking for the revival of a European Roman Empire from which we will have the Anti-Christ and so forth, but again if that is what the whole book of Daniel is talking about Daniel 2 with the metallic statue, Daniel 7 with the four gruesome beasts.
Sid: Well, we’ve been looking for the ten nations to come together in Europe to form that confederacy, I mean there’s is a whole scenario along these lines
Joel: Right and if the majority position, if the position that has been held by the vast majority throughout history is accurate then that verse which says, “This book will be sealed until the end,” does not mean a thing! It doesn’t mean a thing and so what I’ve been expressing to people is that when we look at this classic passage, this metallic statue, the Bible gives us some very clear criteria to identify that fourth empire. In Daniel 2:40 it says, “That when this empire arises it will crush all of the others,” and the others of course are Babylon, Persia and Greece. And for those modern minds that are not given to ancient history, just think Iraq, Iran and Turkey and Greece. And the question that we have to ask ourselves is did the Roman Empire conquer Iraq, Iran and Greece and the answer is partially. It conquered part of Greece, it conquered the very edges of Iraq and Babylon, but it never even came close to Persia and this was an essential thing. The Roman Empire does not meet the basic Biblical criteria laid out to qualify as the fourth empire, but there is an empire that does.
Sid: But if what you’re saying is true then most of the scenario’s I’ve read on the ones we’ve mentioned and the ones we haven’t mentioned, see the antichrist and the antichrist system coming out of Europe. If what you’re saying is correct and it sure sounds, makes sense to me that will not occur.
Joel: Well, exactly and again the imagination of the church is fixed, the prophetic end time imagination of the earth today, of the church is fixed on the Roman Empire, the EU, the European Union and so forth. What I’m setting forth is an eschatology that is thoroughly Jerusalem, Israel and Middle Eastern centric. I’m trying to call the church back to a Middle Eastern mindset to recognize that this Book that we look to to understand the days to come has always been an Eastern Book, it’s a Jewish book. And unfortunately we here in the west, we Americans, we have a very American centric mentality. We tend to even believe that the Bible was primarily written for Americans and we tend to read our world view into the pages of the Bible and unfortunately it wasn’t written primarily for us. And so I’m calling people back to understand the centrality of Israel in the end time passages. All of the prophets are speaking about the coming of the Anti Christ that will come out of the surrounding nation. There called the goy subbed or the goyim subbed; the surrounding nations, the nation’s roundabout and those are the nations around about Israel. They’re all Islamic nations today and they all bear that same anti-Semitic spirit that all the precious empires carried with them; whether it be Babylon or Medo-Persian or Greece they all carried the anti-Semitic, anti-Yahweh spirit and they came against the Jewish people. It’s exactly what we see throughout the Middle East today.
Sid: And you go on to explain Matthew 24 verse 10 to 13. And the Greek actually says that something is going to happen in the end-times that will cause the love of most go grow cold.
Joel: Well, exactly. Now imagine this and imagine if the over arching majority of the church is convinced that we’re going to see the anti-Christ come out of Europe, when in fact the anti-Christ could very well be emerging right before our eyes in the Middle East and I don’t know who the anti-Christ is now, but instead of looking to the east. You know imagine this Sid, the church is a city on a hill; imagine an ancient city, and ancient walled city and many in the church are called to be watchman, watchman on the wall. And what we have is we have hundreds of watchman and their all gathered on the western wall and there’s a few people that are saying watchman we need to bring some people to the eastern wall, we need to balance this thing out. We need to be looking in all directions considering all position and the majority of the church is saying no, we know that the anti-Christ comes from Europe. Is this not much different than the days when Jesus came the first time when Yeshua came and the Pharisees were convinced that they understood eschatology and as a result they missed the coming of the Messiah?
Sid: Well, I’m told that when people go through this three DVD series called “Islam and The End Times,” ninety-nine percent of the people when they see it so clear on all the end-time theology God’s given you they agree with what they’ve heard.
Joel: You know I get emails and letters and so forth everyday and the thing that I hear over and over again is that they say, “Joel, you know I got saved during the Jesus movement and I read “The Late Great Planet Earth” and that impacted me; when Israel became a nation that was powerful. But since those days I’ve become cynical and I’ve turned away for a study of the end times, I’ve come to you know just get a skeptical, cynical perspective on these things. But when I heard you lay these things out for the first time in twenty years, my heart was awakened and I knew the things that you were saying were true and I bore witness in my spirit; it made sense it was easy to understand and I am stirred a fresh to give myself to holiness in preparing for the coming of the Lord.” I get emails like this constantly.
Sid: But let me give you my spin on the end times, there’s one thing that I know for sure. What I know for sure is the popular scenario that most Christians have been taught, the one thing I know for sure is that it’s not correct. Now I didn’t know for sure what was correct, but I knew for sure that that wasn’t correct and that alone when people look at those scenarios as if it’s scripture that’s going to throw them off when things are very different in the end times.
Joel: It’s a dangerous reality and unfortunately Sid, what we have today is that we have many people that are very very good students of their teachers, they’re not always good students of the Bible. And we need teachers today that can teach the scriptures clearly, but who also call the people to be Bereans and to dig into the scriptures with a prayerful heart to understand and to look for and to ask the Holy Spirit to teach them about the things shortly about to take place on the earth. These events are real, there has to be a generation that would see these things and again because of the things in the book of Daniel and throughout the Bible are being opened up that is proof that in fact, we are living in the end times.
Sid: Well, one of the things that I find fascinating is God’s directed you to live in the Middle East and you studied Islam, you lived among Muslims and you began to see similarities between what the Bible refers to as the anti-Christ and what Islam refers to as the Mahadi or their messiah.
Joel: Exactly, when I began to study what Muslims believe about the end times and believe me I have literally read every book in the world that has been published in English on this subject. What I saw was that Islam teaches about the end times is a perfect anti-parallel to what the Bible teaches. They have literally taken the Biblical story about the end times flipped it on its head. They’ve made their anti-Christ into our Messiah; they’ve made our Messiah, into their Anti-Christ vice versa. Everything that we look to as holy they call blasphemy; everything that we believe to be evil, they say is godly. When it comes to anti-Semitism we see as a mark of the anti-Christ, they see that as the mark of the coming messiah, the coming Islamic messiah. In fact Muslims actually teach that one of the marks of the anti-Christ is that he will be followed by Jews; that he will be Jewish and he will claim to be Jesus Christ the Devine Son of God.
Sid: Muslims claim he will be Jewish.
Joel: Yeah, they claim that the anti-Christ will be Jewish
Sid: Oh, I see.
Joel: They call him, Ah dajjal, so in Islam their belief about the Anti-Christ, they call him Ah Dajjal Desi.
Sid: So that’s going to justify even more, add fuel to the fire of their anti-Semitism.
Joel: Oh, absolutely, oh numerous when you read the Islamic books about the end times it is a mixture of anti-Semitic conspiracy theory. The protocols of the elders of Zion, all of this Anti-Semitic stuff mixed with end time things; mixed with all sorts of conspiracy theories that are wildly popular throughout the Middle East.
Sid: And yet, what basic Koran Islam teaches is the opposite of what the Bible says about the Messiah.
Joel: Exactly, not only the Koran but the Islamic sacred traditions known as the Hadee.
Sid: I tell you what, we’re out of time.
Sid: My guest Kevin Dedmon has written a new book called “Unlocking Heaven.” He is doing what the Bible says everyone should do. He is equipping what the Bible says everyone should be able to do; the same works that Jesus did you should do also. And we’ve been finding out all this week about keys that he has not that he is doing it, but how you can walk in the supernatural. You know there’s a subject that you talk about in your book that has, it just intrigue me no end; I notice that when Jesus prays for the sick Kevin He has supernatural compassion, how can we walk in that supernatural compassion?
Kevin: Well, Jesus was filled with compassion and we need to be filled with compassion and once we’re filled with compassion then we are compelled by compassion to reach out and touch those who are around us just like Jesus did with the leper in Mark Chapter 1 verses 40 through 42. You know, “Being filled with compassion he reached out and touched the man and said, I am willing, be clean.” And so I think that we just need to ask for more of that compassion, not only to see the one that has the need, but to stop for the one and then help the one that has the need and then realize that we have what it takes to bring the answer to their life.
Sid: Now, most Christians think in terms of, “Well if someone is sick, I’ll bring them to my church when my church has a healing service.” But you tell people go out where the sick people are and you may even see better results.
Kevin: Absolutely, there are times when I walk into a hospital and I’ll go into the emergency room waiting area and I’ll say “Hey, if you don’t want to wait for the doctor I can take care of you now, because I consider myself and a physician’s assistant.” I assist the great physician and so I like to go where sick people are. I’ll never forget my son and I we walked into a hospital one time, we were going to visit somebody and I was walking past the emergency room waiting areas and I said to my son and the pastor we were with I said, “We, need to go right in here and take care of these people.” And on the way back out I did, I said “Hey, does anybody here have a problem with their left knee?” And sure enough a guy has a problem with the left knee, so I’m praying for him and the daughter has whip lash and she’s in the emergency room to get that taken care of. She gets healed; my son’s healing somebody with a back injury and the pastor’s there with his jaw down to the ground as we’re healing everybody that’s in this waiting room. And you know it’s just that easy, taking some risks, knowing that we’re physician assistants so to speak and just going out and doing the stuff.
Sid: There is such a presence of the Spirit of God that has just come, and this actually has been on the whole interview but especially strong today. What does God want to do today to our listeners?
Kevin: Well, He certainly wants us to be whole, He wants us to be healed, He wants us to be encouraged, you know He wants us to be empowered and equipped. And you know my heart more than anything else is that we would know God’s goodness for ourselves. That we would know that God’s in a good mood towards us and that the good news is not towards others it’s towards us as well. And that we would experience healing in our own lives.
Sid: You know you talk about laying hands on ourself.
Kevin: Ha-ha-ha yeah, you know I’ve done it myself, I’ve called out my own word of knowledge before. I’ve stood up in a meeting where they were giving words of knowledge. I had a rotator cuff injury for eight months and I had everybody pray for it and nothing was seemingly happening. It wasn’t getting any better and so there were sixty Words of knowledge given out and it was a Randy Clark Healing School that I was at and towards the end I knew that he was getting ready to shut down the words of knowledge and I wanted my right rotator cuff healed. So I stood up myself, I turned around to the audience and 750 people and I called out right rotator cuff and immediately I was healed and I’ve been healed ever since; this has been about three or four years.
Sid: So that wasn’t a word of knowledge per se as what you wanted God to manifest at that moment.
Kevin: That’s right it was just faith that rose up in me and hunger and you know He rewards the hungry. You know Heaven is attracted to hunger and when we’re hungry for something God just comes and He brings it. It’s like the persistent widow that comes before the judge and she gets what she wants.
Sid: Well, do you know what I noticed in reading your book, many times you’ll pray for someone and nothing will manifest, but the next day, but even the next week you’ll find out that they were healed.
Kevin: That’s exactly right, when I pray He comes. And when He comes He does good things because He is a good God and a good mood and that’s the good news. And so I pray with confidence every single time I pray, knowing not believing, not hoping not expecting, but knowing that God comes. It’s like ultra sound, you can’t see it, you can’t feel it, you can’t smell it; and it goes into your muscles and it starts to work inside there and it starts doing things that you can’t comprehend in you know in the outside. And the Kingdom of God is kind of like that it’s like spiritual ultrasound and it’s going in there and it’s doing job. And if we learn to give thanks for what God is doing, even when we just feel His presence it opens up an avenue for further breakthrough even in giving thanks. It’s like Jesus with the feeding of the 5,000 when he told his disciples to feed them and they looked at the resource that they had 5 loaves and 2 fish and they said, “We don’t have enough,” and they didn’t. Jesus took the same resource, gave thanks and he got breakthrough and He got abundance, He got leftovers. And so it’s the same way in healing, you know if you’re only 5% improved after you release the Kingdom His presence on you and you begin to give thanks; often times what will happen is that it will increase and more breakthrough will come. I’ve seen that more than anything else that people they’ll get a little measure even just a little bit of it, maybe they’re just feeling peace; the peace of God and I’ll encourage them to give thanks for His presence in the peace. And they’ll do that and they’re tumors will dissolve, their cancers will leave, their bones will mend, the creative miracles will happen.
Sid: I believe if you will sing over people right now, the creative miracles will happen.
Kevin: Alright then, well take it. It’s the end of the pain as you know it’s the end of your pain as you know it, it’s the end of your pain as you know it, you feel fine. Ha-ha now sing that over yourself.
Sid: It’s the end of the pain as you know it; it’s the end of your pain as you know it, it’s the end of your pain as you know it, you feel fine.
Kevin: Ha-ha, that’s right, so just take that now, take His presence and let it permeate every organ of your body, every cell of your body, every bone, every joint and be in health, be in wholeness. And just realize that as you receive this now that you have the same ability to release it to those around you. In fact we had a gal who her jaw was totally numb and the dentist had severed her nerve in her jaw, she couldn’t feel her jaw; she couldn’t feel her chin. And the doctor said that it would take at least ten months to get feeling back if it would ever come back at all. She sang that song immediately the feeling came back in her jaw and her chin, in her whole face. The next week her brother was in a car accident and he was in a coma in another state. She went up there, the whole family was there, she sang this song over her brother who was in a coma and when she finished the last line and he came out of the coma and he was totally healed. And so I just release that same impartation right now to everybody who’s listening, that you are physician’s assistant, that you have what it takes to bring the Kingdom into any situation through the compassion of Father God, the Father of Compassion. And that when you release His Kingdom good things happen because God is in a good mood and He doing good things and that’s the good news. And a yeah…
Sid: Well, Mishpochah he just released a key to you and some of you might have missed it, but I certainly didn’t miss it. I’ve often wondered when someone says well, if you’re 5% healed thank God, well, I haven’t felt 5% healed, but I certainly felt the presence of God and I could be, I missed it and you missed it, you could have been thanking God. I certainly have been thinking about the goodness of God, He’s been revealing Himself to me. Begin praising God in that type of an atmosphere and guess what, God can’t resist that.